ABC-7 Xtra: San Jacinto Plaza

>>> live where news comes first, this is “abc-7 xtra. >>> good evening, i’m maria garcia. glad you’re with us on “abc- xtra.” after more than two years of delays, san jacinto plaza is finally finished and open to the public! the crown jewel of downtown el paso was closed for about three years, a sight of frustration and disappointment for el pasoans. but this weekend, it was a sight of celebration. there are still a lot of learning lessons here and we’re going to talk about them. from how the city chose contractors to why it added items to the construction list. who was supposed to join us, city reps cortney niland and peter svarzbein. we’re still waiting on representative niland who confirmed to our newsroom earlier this week that she would be here but she is not yet here. we’re hoping she will arrive during the program. but rep peter svarzbein does join us. you can e-mail us your comments and questions now to abc7xtra@kvia.com. you can also reach us at 915-496-1775 or tweet me at @mariagabc7. before our discussion, let’s get a recap of the grand opening this weekend. here’s our jerry najera. >> you know the san jacinto plaza became the city’s official plaza 113 years ago in 1903? and while it took a few years to renovate, people happily got reacquainted with los lagartos. ? ? there was music. there was food. there was ping pong. and of course, the famous lagartos. some were skeptical of the change. >> i was a little upset when i heard they were going to renovate it because i thought it was fine the way it was and i didn’t want them to change the historical value. >> but once they saw the iconic alligators, flashy signs, chess tables and splash pad, el pasoans already their favorite spot. >> the alligators. >> the lagartos. >> the canopy. >> the alligators. >> the ping pong tables. i wasn’t expecting that. that’s pretty cool. >> it was a long time coming. mayor oscar leeser apologized to the crowd about the delay during the unveiling. >> we do owe you an apology for being late. we were late, it wasn’t done in the timely manner that we would have wished it done. >> but it’s done. and leeser says now that the gates and orange barrels are gone, all of el paso can enjoy the first-lass park. >> the quality and the finished product is incredible. >> residents seemed to agree with him, too, saying the wait was well worth it, giving it an overwhelming thumbs up. >> we have a fantastic downtown and everything is happening here. >> the vibe you can feel it people laying down and enjoying the weather. >> you can just see and feel a different atmosphere. >> a final price tag has not yet been released. it’s definitely running into the millions. on a lighter note people are already looking forward to using the plaza for the neon desert music festival. >> all right, that report this weekend. thank you so much for doing that. with us, city rep peter svarzbein, next to him an empty chair because we’re waiting for representative cortney niland who confirmed to our newsroom that she will be here and we are hoping she will arrive. i want to ask you construction began june 2013. obviously, you’ve only been on council since last summer. you were not in office at the time. but you were on a citizens committee that looked at the design of the san jacinto plaza and provided the city with really valuable input. >> actually, the first month i came back to el paso in 2011 after being born and raised here. i came back and i was asked to join the citizens review committee chaired by nester valencia and steve ortega. it was a five person committee, catherine brennen, and others were part of this committee and basically, what we were looking at as a committee was what are those things that makes san jacinto plaza el paso’s plaza? what is it that we need to keep in that park and add to it that ca be reflective not just of where the city’s going but what it has? and some of those recommendations you saw into the final design. number one was the former axial design of the park, having the diagonal line, every single town has something like a plaza there. second was to keep los lagartos in the center of the park. another recommendation was a balustrade and something i brought in personally from the committee was concrete ping-pong tables and chess tables which i saw in the east village of new york city when i used to live there. >> and we’re going to get to these features in just a bit. i want to talk about some of the learning less than — lessons here. construction was supposed to be completed january 2014. and then the city said, you know, we’re facing some delays. and then they said december, not of this past year, but the year before that. and then that didn’t happen. and before you know it, it just kept extending and extending and extending. and it almost became sort of like this parody. there were memes. >> the back to the future memes. those were probably the best ones. >> where people were like 30 years later. >> 2061 i think it was. >> and it just became even like this running joke type of thing and it made a lot of people lose faith in the city and, you know, now, you can say it’s a great celebration, it’s wonderful but a lot of people are still, like, it’s unacceptable for it to take three years to finish the plaza. >> absolutely. again, i wasn’t part of the council that had voted to use basic idea i.q. i haven’t been in there for the majority of the time that was there. i can tell you one of the things that this council has looked at is correcting some of the procurement issues that arose from that because what happened is you had a procurement issue where the lowest value was graded the highest so if you came in $2 million under the rest of the bids, you would be de facto the number one bidder so one of the things that we’re looking at now with some of the other projects that are coming online with the quality of life bond are having it weighted not just necessarily towards cost but also experience. so if you’ve done projects like that you would get weighted higher than necessarily how cheap you can do it. >> when we heard the presentation from the purchasing director a few weeks ago who briefed the city on why the system was set up that way it seemed so counterintuitive. common sense would tell you you need to weigh experience as much as you weigh costs because i think the consensus is from people whom we’ve spoken to is it was not the right firm for this project. in 2011, they told the city that they could get it done with $4.5 million which was significantly lower than the rest of the bids. at least another company told the city, i remember it so clearly, the other company who was competing to build san jacinto build san jacinto plaza told the city council it’s impossible to do it with $4.6 million. you’re not going to get it done with that kind of money. and at that time, the city management assured the city council, you know, we are confident in basic idea i.q., we are confident this project will come on time and on budget, fast forward later, i’m sure there are people who regret voting for them to get that contract. >> i think there’s a lot of lessons to be learned, and i think that we’re learning those lessons and trying to see what was there, and i think that’s part of you know, what bruce talked about is addressing some of those concerns there but thank that at the end of the day with this park you’re looking at something that was really i think that anybody that walks into the park, it’s really an exceptional jewel that we have here. and in previous councils, you know, there’s always lessons to be learned. there’s always things that need to be tweaked that in hindsight somebody thinks it’s a really great idea but in practice it’s different than in theory. >> yeah, again initially they said they could do it with about $4.6 million. that budget was eventually expanded to $6 million. right now, the city says they don’t have a complete final budget. >> first of all, the first budget was for $6 million. so that’s what was budgeted in the quality of life bond budget was $6 million. so it wasn’t that the 4.5, and now whatever it’s at is over-budget. $6 million is what was budgeted originally for the plan that the voters approved in 2012, overwhelmingly approved. >> okay. >> so i don’t think that there’s any hard number. there’s a lot of issues and things that they’re going about in terms of costs and everything like that. so i’m not exactly sure when we’re going to get a hard number. >> right. thank you for clarifying that. and that’s also because, you know, now that it’s completed, the city has to go back with the contractor and figure out how much the contractor owes the city because as of last summer the city started charging the contractor $1,000 a day for every day that it was delayed so now, the city and the contractor have to go back and forth and figure out how much it owes the city. >> yeah. but on that note, it was not solely to blame. i know you were just elected last summer. this was a question that i was going to pose to representative niland but she’s not here. the city requested nearly two dozen change orders before last may. and some of those were big ones like moving the large electrical boxes from over the ground to underground. that’s an expensive, timely, complex addition to the project. so when you have the city and some of these changes came from city council members, you know. >> which i was not part of. >> requesting to change these things. i mean that delays. the blame isn’t solely to blame with the contractor. anything you would like to add to that, representative? >> i think the park is really nice right now. [ laughs ] okay. >> okay. adrian i’m sure people at home thinking gosh, that’s really awkward. >> i mean, this is hard because i wasn’t a council member at the time when the change orders were made, i was not a council member there and i’m not trying to deflect blame there but i don’t really feel it’s responsible for me to go and talk about what decisions were made when i wasn’t there so it’s hard for me to sort of respond there. i can tell you that since i’ve been elected it was — i saw representative niland really try to be on top of this as much as possible and she was a tremendous advocate to get this done as quick as possible and to be the best value for the representatives. i want to tell you another thing, walking through the park yesterday morning, seeing representative niland, she spent probably an hour going and talking to dozens and dozens of people asking them to see what their favorite part of the park was. i think she took a lot of pride in wanting to see that park well there and it was something really remarkable to see her take that time yesterday to really go and take the extra step and seeing what people were thinking. >> right and we certainly hope that she’s okay and she didn’t have an emergency. >>> adrian tweeting at us will the final cost be provided for san jacinto plaza or because of the private money will the costs not be disclosed? this was all funded by public money. >> 72% of the voters voted for the 2012 quality of life bond project. >> and this was included in the quality of life bond project. adrian also tweeting at us hashtag #sjp, san jacinto plaza, acronym there, is a symptom of a bigger problem. outside inexperienced contractor, lack of laws to protect local business. let’s go to rick in central i believe on the phone. hi, rick what’s your comment or your question? >> how can we build a ballpark in one year and we can’t build a park within one years? it took three years? it shows a sign of poor leadership. >> thank you very much. that’s a comment we heard over and over again, like her was this massive project, this award winning ballpark, top notch, amazing amenities. and then it was done in a year. >> and we dedicated the former head of the engineering department, alan schubert was dedicated to that one project. that’s how important it was. >> and there was also a private sector partnership component. >> and a public-private partnership. seeing that project happen, it’s something that you had an all hands on deck approach. you had a design built that really helped to also continue that along and there was also very fast deadlines. none of that excuses why a park, it took as long as it did. >> but if you had, you know, your head engineer on such a complex project essentially completely hands-on on the ballpark. we’re seeing then that this was around the time when the engineering department started to sort of display real symptoms that it was in trouble, that things started sort of unraveling. you had suddenly, a bunch of quality of life bond projects on the pipeline pending scoping of work that had to be done and yet including san jacinto plaza which wasn’t in the quality of life bond yet, a limited number of employees, we know based on some of the studies that the city has done that apparently the engineering department lacked leadership until recently and processes. so what’s being done to improve that? >> well, the city just hired i think under a month ago a public works director who’s coming from the city of baltimore. i think he was the assistant deputy city mayor, he has decades of experience working in engineering departments and traffic departments and so he’s coming in hear to really oversee not just the engineering department but traffic, as well. and i think he’s going to bring a sense of a veteran coming in here and being able to help with that and also in the interim, the airport has stepped up to provide some leadership at a, too. >> what’s your comment or your question? >> i went to the park today and i have two concerns. my first concern is that the cars are parking right next to the plaza on main street and they’re damaging the plants. they have to paint the curb yellow so the cars will not park there and the second is that the canopy, alligator canopy maybe they need to work on that. >> thank you very much. issues with the parking surrounding the park, maybe some stripings would help so that cars will know exactly where to park and also that some of the lights on the canopy for the alligators weren’t on and that it looked really sad. >> well, the park has been open less than 48 hours, there’s always going to be some kinks that need to be worked out. walking through and seeing it lit up at night, i think it’s pretty inspirational and to talk about that canopy, you know, going back to that citizens review committee, one of the ideas was to have a lot of shade in the park, to have it as a green lawn. and we were looking at something, maybe suggesting different trees planted closer to the sculpture to shade them. the metal canopy was one that was there in the final design. and while it looks very modern and a little bit unorthodox compared to the plaza that we’ve known before i was actually really interesting to see it architecturey — architecturally in practice, people gathering around the balustrades, the little columns, people were crowding around it like they used to do in postcards from the ’20s and ’30s. people mostly spent their time around the alligators, on the balustrades. and it was interesting to see it occur in 2016 because of the canopy. now, the canopy provides shade. it’s one of the most shaded areas of the park pretty much almost the entire time of the day so people were still congregating around the alligators. granted it was a sculpture from one of the most amazing sculptors from el paso. but they were still there in the shade, throwing pennies and dimes back into the pool again and i don’t know if that’s necessarily the most appropriate thing to do. >> it’s so interesting because i think it was you who posted a photo on social media or several people did and i saw several people like congregating around them and it was so reminiscent of the old black and white photos of the ’20s and ’30s of people doing the exact same thing. it was a really interesting moment. the canopy. [ laughs ] now, you see it and you’re like i’m sure there’s a lot of people saying i get it it was worth it but for a while, that was part of the big delay, it was like it’s in germany, oh, something went wrong, it has to come back again from germany. oh, it’s stuck in customs. you know, it was — >> there’s a lot of lessons to be learned from the park. the cables are doing a great job now. another thing about the lighting, you have a lighting that’s lit for the canopy, lighting coming down directly onto los lagartos as well as the reflecting pool, as well. there’s a lot of thought in the design and that was part of why it took as long as it did. the park itself is very intricately designed. there’s a lot of nooks and crannies, a lot of thought out places and, you know, it took time to do but the results of it are really great. another thing about it is you think about somebody visiting our city and, you know, different — you look at the plaza that santa fe has, for example, or a plaza that you might see in another city. and our plaza if somebody was visiting in and they’re like what is it about? they go to our plaza and they see at the center of it art. they see at the center of it a respect for culture and a respect for history. and i think that that’s something that’s really, really strong and something that we should all be proud about is we chose as a community to celebrate our history and our identity. >> okay. we’re going to take a commercial break. when we come back, we’re going to go to the phone lines to get your comments and questions and we’re going to talk about the design that the citizens committee came up with, which city council adopted from that design and compare to what the plaza looks like. so stay with us. remember you can call us at (916)496-1775 abc7xtra@kvia.com or tweet me >>> welcome back to “abc- xtra.” we’re talking about san jacinto plaza today. let’s get to twitter, and then we’re going to get to the phone lines. martin tweeting at us is basic idea i.q. currently contracted to do any other work for the city of el paso? i don’t think they are at all. and gabriel saying is the city receiving aggravation from privately owned restaurants or cafes after building their own with public funds? i’m assuming he’s referring to the cafe inside the plaza. >> so i don’t yet know about that. that’s something interesting because myself i’ve been involved in downtown. i had a pop-up gallery around there for a couple of years and actually, still have it, we opened up in the current space about a month before construction began on the. [ applause ] what’s interesting about the cafe that’s there currently is that the times that it’s operating i think are a little bit different than some of the normal times. most restaurants around town are open around a sort of business schedule so it’s 11:00 to 3:00 usually. the park is from 11:00 to 7:00, and i think it’s a different sort of food there. you see this from time to time, these issues. i rember when the food truck city opened up the food truck food court that was there on mills there was some of the other property owners that were concerned that it might take away business but what you see is when you have that bunching of restaurants and business, you actually get more people coming in because now, there’s more options and this restaurant, you know, the restaurant that’s in the cafe might have a line. however, there’s a restaurant that’s half a block away that there is no line so they might walk to that. >> adrian tweeting at us as cortney niland represents the area her absence speaks louder than anything freshman council member peter svarzbein can address. and also tweeting at us will the city plan to invest in all areas of el paso or just focus on downtown? >> i think that the city is investing in a lot of different parts. again, san jacinto plaza was a quality of life bond project that was approved in 2012. the east side has a park complex that’s also going to have a pool in it as well as an olympic sized pool. the northeast as well as parts of my district as well have trailheads that are going to be investments and you have paved trails that were approved by the 2012 quality of life bond project that are throughout the city as well so there’s a lot of different parts and a lot of other improvements as well to many different parts of the city that are part of the quality of life bond projects. >> martin tweeting refresh our memories but wasn’t rep niland the one responsible for the work order changes? that remains unclear. we have looked into that. we do know there were city reps who at least provided input, potentially even directed some of the change orders but that has not been independently confirmed. we don’t know if she was responsible for the work order changes but we do know that they came from the city, that’s something we’ve tried to look into. and it’s something that we hoped to ask her but again, she’s not here and we hope she’s okay and not having an emergency. let’s go to our phone lines. let’s see, who’s the next caller, will on the west side, what’s your comment or your question? >> i would like to find out if they had this problem with the parks and the mayor acknowledges, he apologized for it, how do we entrust the arena to these people? thank you. >> thank you very much. i mean, $180 million arena. i mean, massive project. how can taxpayers expect the city to deliver on time and on budget if it was such a nightmare with san jacinto? >> well, i want to tell will that basic idea i.q. will not be doing the arena. >> he was referring to the city. >> okay. glad to confirm that. >> i mean, i think that’s pretty clear and as we mentioned, it’s not all basic idea i.q.’s fault. >> so i think that again looking at these signature quality of life bond projects, the city has looked at tweaking the procurement process again, more than just value but also experience so looking for people that have experience in building projects like a multipurpose performance facility and arena and building a children’s museum. that’s important to weigh that there. also, the kind of construction method whether it’s design build or looking at having a specific project manager similar to the baseball project i think are also things that the city is exploring, as well. >> so to make it sort of abundantly clear to will, it comes down to the way the city was scoring contractors. >> i think partially yeah. >> okay we’re going to take a commercial break. when we come back, we’re going to take juan >>> welcome back to “abc- xtra.” let’s go straight to your phone calls. haunch on the east side on the phone. >> instead of hitting the lowest bid, they need to get the most qualified bid on time and under budget. >> do you want to comment on that? >> i think with looking with some of the procurement methods adding to our toolbox, looking at not just best value but also experience and having that weighed significantly as well i think is going to help. >> let’s go to james on the west side. james what’s your comment or your question? >> yes, i was wondering why peter is taking most of the questions when he hasn’t even been on council for a year and second why isn’t cortney niland there? she’s an elected official. she should be there. >> i agree with you. i agree with you. you know, we had these questions prepared, we were under the assumption that ms. niland would be here. again, she confirmed with our newsroom earlier this week that she would be here. i don’t know why she’s not here. i agree she should be here. i hope that it was not a miscommunication between us but i was assured she had confirmed to be on here. and i have not heard from her personally and we hope that she has not faced an emergency but if she has not faced an emergency, i agree, she should be here answering these questions. hence the empty chair. >>> okay let’s go to joe from the northeast, is that who’s next? >> i’m very disappointed that the entire city council and city manager weren’t there for the grand opening of such an important city project. that shows very poor leadership as far as the absentee — the council not being there. >> so he’s saying he’s disappointed he didn’t see all of the city council at the grand opening. you were there. >> i was there. i was happy to be there. >> who do you see there? >> district six, representative acosa, as were i and rep niland. >> okay. and let’s go to twitter. henry tweeting at us has he heard back from paypal? you started a social media campaign to get paypal to move their offices to el paso since they canceled opening their offices in charlotte after the bathroom transgender bill that a lot of people think is discriminatory. >> i think it is discriminatory. again, i think that we have a lot of opportunities there. i personally have not heard back from paypal. i still wake up in the morning, i brush my teeth and i tweet them. but i believe that, you know — i think that our economic development team and the people in the region that were responsible for economic recruitment are reaching out to them and many other companies every week. again but i think what was wonderful about it is again us, us as a city going and speaking out about the things that make the city great. when there’s an opportunity as ugly as the law that north carolina passed there, there’s an opportunity for our city to talk about those values of tolerance and diversity and inclusion that we’ve had a history of that goes back beyond many other cities in texas. >> all right, representative, thank you so much for joining us. we have run out of time. lots to look forward to in downtown el paso. we have the trolley coming, the arena in 2022 or 2023. >> 2021 i believe. >> 2021. >> mexican american cultural center, the children’s museum. >> and that means a lot of construction, a lot of growth and a lot of construction. >> i also had something for you, as well. >> oh, okay. you make this a tradition every time you come. >> can you get the camera over on this? >> i’m not sure we can. >> this is a wonderful pin. >> san jacinto plaza. >> with los lagartos on there, as well. i thought you would appreciate it, i would look great on a blazer or something else. it’s really, really nice. just one of the wonderful gifts that were there on hand on saturday. i hope that you cherish that and again, it would look good on a blazer. >> is that a hint for me to wear more blazers? >> can’t go wrong. >> thank you very much. we appreciate it. thank you so much for joining us here on “abc-7 xtra. we hope you found this informative and we’ll see